Inkscape Forum Inkscape > Inkscape and DXF files?

The school where I work has a laser cutter attached to a pc. The pc runs
'PC Design', outputing to the cutter.

http://www.techsoftuk.co.uk/techsoft_software.htm

As well as it's own propriety files, PC Design will accept dxf files to
output to the cutter. I've tried importing dxf files created with
Inkscape into PC Design, but they don't get rendered.

Are the dxf files created by Inkscape's export non standard or otherwise
'funny'? Does anyone know of a 'workaround' for this problem, please?

Jim Ford

Jim Ford wrote:
> Are the dxf files created by Inkscape's export non standard or otherwise 
> 'funny'? Does anyone know of a 'workaround' for this problem, please?

The DXF files exported by Inkscape export curves as standard DXF
SPLINEs. Some software is not able to handle such NURB curves. An option
would be to decompose the curves into polylines, though this would make
the output noticeably slower and less exact. Please recognise that the
DXF output from Inkscape is not expected to be generally useful DXF
output. It was developed to suit the needs of a very specific community
of users and is labeled as such.

Aaron Spike

Hi Jim

Aaron was also kind enough to answer my dxf related questions last week.
He showed me where the source code is for the scaling. I have a long
thread dxf related questions I can forward. I am reading though the low
level details from some documentation listed in the scripts comments.

"In the tarball the python script lives in
share/extensions/dxf_outlines.py. In ubuntu I'd guess it lives in
/usr/share/inkscape/extensions/dxf_outlines.py."

Hi Aaron

I am not a great programmer but fortunately I can program in Python. Do
you think the dxf output from Inkscape can be made useful for standard
CAD stuff? I was going to write a script with a GUI to allow people to
control the scaling?

Thanks-Patrick

Patrick wrote:
> I am not a great programmer but fortunately I can program in Python. Do 
> you think the dxf output from Inkscape can be made useful for standard 
> CAD stuff? I was going to write a script with a GUI to allow people to 
> control the scaling?


There are plenty of improvements that could be made to the
dxf_outlines.py script. You can see that it is very simplistic right
now. We could make the scaling configurable via the gui. We could give
the user an option to perform polyline approximation of curves. (There
is a simple routine for this in flatten.py. It could be improved to be
both faster and more accurate. cf.
http://www.cs.concordia.ca/cccg/papers/36.pdf ) And I'm sure you could
think of other things. But I think we must be careful not to forget the
class of users for whom the script was originally created. I would like
to retain this simple, preconfigured output option for them. (This could
be done by having two INX files point to the same script, one providing
more configurability and the other providing a configuration equivalent
to the current script.)

Aaron Spike

Hi Aaron

Thanks for all your dxf help! I would really like to get involved with
extending Inkscapes dxf support. I would however need some guidance and
I am overloaded so progress will be a little slow.

Here is what I was thinking:
Following along with your feelings on the matter-

"But I think we must be careful not to forget the
class of users for whom the script was originally created. I would like
to retain this simple, preconfigured output option for them"


We could create another menu that just brings up:
wishblade
robocraft
blah blah cutter etc
custom

The menu items would simply bring up save-as dialogs pre-configured with
the correct scaling for their device, only the custom dialog would bring
up a dialog that could have variable scaling.

If other Inkscape users wanted to email me/mail me their dxf outputs and
the actual outputs from their devices, I could reconfigure the scaling
and we could add another menu item.

I guess I am going to have to learn a little Qcad/Autcad. However if I
did this right I might be able to save others from having to learn these
other Apps. This new Inkscape feature would really scratch my itch too.
I am trying to get replacement parts made. If I can scan them, convert
them to svg, then dxf. Then I can send off the CAD files to machine
shops for quotes and fabrication. I wanted to buy a CNC mill, but you
know it is just so cheap to get these shops to make stuff, that it
doesn't make sense.

What do you think?-Patrick

Aaron and Patrick
That would be great,  you do not know how many folks I have walked
through this in the cutter forum.  I would be more than happy to
generate and send you any files you need from Wishblade, Robomaster or
Silhouette or any other program for the cutter world.  Please feel free
to contact me at bibimorris@sbcglobal.net.

Bibi

--
Inkscapes by Bibi Morris
All cutter files designed exclusively in Inkscape

Find my Cutting designs at
http:\\inkscapesbybibi.cuttersmarket.com
www.Cuttersmarket.com

Private Inkscape, and WB/CR/Silhouette classes available

Hi Bibi

Thanks for your help. I really think we can do this and I would really
like to try. Your offer of help with the cutters makes it even more
do-able. I would really like to know what Aaron thinks. I can do all the
work but with Aaron's experience pointing me in the right direction it
could save time and produce a better result.

Terry has also offered to help with the dxf files too and he is a
mechanical designer.

Let's see what tomorrow brings :-) Good night-Patrick



Thank again!

Aaron has helped us before, and I will send you any kind of files you 
want.
Just let me know, and they are yours.
Bibi

--
Inkscapes by Bibi Morris
All cutter files designed exclusively in Inkscape

Find my Cutting designs at
http:\\inkscapesbybibi.cuttersmarket.com
www.Cuttersmarket.com

Private Inkscape, and WB/CR/Silhouette classes available

Bibi Morris wrote:
> That would be great,  you do not know how many folks I have walked 
> through this in the cutter forum.  I would be more than happy to 
> generate and send you any files you need from Wishblade, Robomaster or 
> Silhouette or any other program for the cutter world.  Please feel free 
> to contact me at bibimorris@sbcglobal.net.

Did people need to use different scalings inorder to use our DXFs with
different cutters on that forum? Exactly what are you spending time
walking people through? (Maybe we can fix it and save you some time.) As
far as referencing names of specific cutters, I avoided that on purpose
before because I didn't know anything about the issues involved in
referencing trademarks.

Aaron Spike

Patrick wrote:
> Thanks for your help. I really think we can do this and I would really 
> like to try. Your offer of help with the cutters makes it even more 
> do-able. I would really like to know what Aaron thinks. I can do all the 
> work but with Aaron's experience pointing me in the right direction it 
> could save time and produce a better result.

As long as Bibi is happy, I'm happy. :-) I'm still not exactly sure what
  new needs we should address. But I'm happy to help whenever I can.

Aaron Spike

We would need to think about referencing trade names from Inkscape but I
could look into this with a lawyer. It ties into some of my other needs
so the cost is not a problem. I am not sure if the present dxf option is
working with all the cutters but I feel that there is also a need beyond
this anyhow. Linux and open source Aps are great but there is a real
short fall when CAD comes into the picture. Turning Inkscape into a full
CAD replacement is likely not viable but with just some slight
modifications it could add basic functionality and get lots of us "off
and running".

Here is what I propose:

I was just modifying dxf_outlines so that it would printout the scaling
setting and offer user input to change it. No GUI yet just the basics. I
have a 8 inch/200 mm caliper that is good to 0.01mm or 0.001 inch. I was
thinking that if I changed the scaling for a given device then we could
test the real world output with my caliper. What I was thinking was that
if we wanted to test a plotter for accuracy I could email a dxf file to
a cutter owner, they could cut out a design and mail it to me. I could
then measure it for accuracy and adjust the scaling. I have U.S and
Canadian mailing addresses. I was planning on doing the same thing with
metal parts and I was also planning on sending over dxf outputs to CAD
users like Terry/My Dad/My Brother, they could check the dimensional
accuracy in there given CAD programs.

I stink at C/C++ so I might need some help adding the menu items to
Inkscape but the underlying Python should not pose a problem.

Any thoughts?

Patrick McCavery wrote:
> I stink at C/C++ so I might need some help adding the menu items to 
> Inkscape but the underlying Python should not pose a problem.

If you still think C/C++ that might be a much better way to go. You will
have access to more information in the Inkscape internals and you could
use (and improve) lib2geom to do the curve conversion/approximation much
more quickly and flexibly. Plus you could base your work on the
abandoned GSoC DXF project from two years ago. We could resurrect that
work so it isn't wasted and get way more out of this in the end. Quite
honestly the little python script was just a stop gap and there are
limits to what we can do with it.

Aaron Spike

Hi Aaron

Okay, I can take some time to get up to speed with C/C++ but if someone
could check my code over after that would be good. Could you point me to
the abandoned projects? Why were they abandoned?

Not to push the Python thing but I was wondering, would PyGTK create
another dependency(I assume it would) Would this be a problem if it did?
C/C++ is really for serious programming but other languages like Python
are great for us novice programmers. Would this get more developers
involved and allow for fine tuning by users with basic programming 
skills?

I will need a little time to catch up on C/C++ probably a month or more.

-Patrick

On Oct 22, 2007, at 7:26 AM, Patrick wrote:

> Not to push the Python thing but I was wondering, would PyGTK create
> another dependency(I assume it would) Would this be a problem if it  
> did?
> C/C++ is really for serious programming but other languages like  
> Python
> are great for us novice programmers. Would this get more developers
> involved and allow for fine tuning by users with basic programming  
> skills?

What I've been promoting is integrating hooks so that extensions in
other languages can access and modify things and let Inkscape do all
the presentation work. This would most likely be done using a DOM
tree representing internals so that things can be accessed in a
manner consistent with accessing the document itself.

I'd gone over this with the guys from Scribus, including the main
person who'd worked on their integration of python, and he'd said it
was a much better approach than having to integrate ui work from
Python like they did.

Aaron,
Some of these ladies are so afraid of computers that they need to know
how to down load and install a ttf file on them! It just intimidates
them to try and use their new scrapbooking cutters, and is not the fault
of inkscape, just their fear of doing something wrong.  Many have even
given up dusting around the computers in fear of hitting a button to
turn it on or off!  I have send them all the links to the tutorials and
they just want someone to hand hold when they try something new!
Inkscape when the tool bars change with each function, really mystifies
them!
Bibi

--
Inkscapes by Bibi Morris
All cutter files designed exclusively in Inkscape

Find my Cutting designs at
http:\\inkscapesbybibi.cuttersmarket.com
www.Cuttersmarket.com

Private Inkscape, and WB/CR/Silhouette classes available

The things that are frustrating in using Inkscape to generate files is
that once we have our dxf file , say a title with a mat, and we have the
cut lines in two different colors and everything line in each color
moves together when we do a paths>combine.  Now when we load DXF in the
Robomaster program, we loose the colors, and pick up an aqua color for
the belzer curves, and then also the file that is imported, no longer
had the combined paths combined. If we group then import, it invalidates
the data, meaning that the resulting information gives us unpredictable
results.  Since the Wishblade and Craft Robo software is missing the
align and distribute, putting the files back together again, once the
line colors have been changed and the paths regrouped, in such a task.
If we can somehow find out how that is working on the Robomaster
software, it would sure save a lot of headaches.

Bibi

--

Inkscapes by Bibi Morris
All cutter files designed exclusively in Inkscape

Find my Cutting designs at
http:\\inkscapesbybibi.cuttersmarket.com
www.Cuttersmarket.com

Private Inkscape, and WB/CR/Silhouette classes available

Bibi Morris wrote:
> line colors have been changed and the paths regrouped, in such a task.  
> If we can somehow find out how that is working on the Robomaster 
> software, it would sure save a lot of headaches.

To work well with Robomaster we should really ditch using DXF altogether
and start working in GSD. If you remember I started looking at GSDs. So
far my attempts to find a programmer with a cutter and another
programmer with some math background to assist me in this have failed.
Perhaps someday I'll have to get a cutter like this so that I have
something to work on. Of course time is short too. :-)

Aaron Spike

Aaron,
Blush, I have a programming background and a math, but have not used it
in a while. I used to do a lot of Cobol programming, and have taken some
C and some C++, however I have never worked with those in industry, so I
am as rusty as a nail when it comes to that.
Ideally if we could generate the GSD files it would be fantastic.  I
think that the companies are trying to sit on the file formats, so they
can charge $10 or more for a simple file that I can create in inkscape
in less than 5 minutes.

Let me know if you need me to dump some files and what to take a look 
at.
Bibi

--
Inkscapes by Bibi Morris
All cutter files designed exclusively in Inkscape

Find my Cutting designs at
http:\\inkscapesbybibi.cuttersmarket.com
www.Cuttersmarket.com

Private Inkscape, and WB/CR/Silhouette classes available

Hi,

I have already done the same kind of thing but from dxf to svg.
have a look at 
http://sancelot.wordpress.com/2007/07/13/enhanced-dxf2svg/

you will find my code :
// create curves points from spline definition
void spline::compute_path()
{
int step = 25;
double t,t2,t3;
double Cm1,C0,C1,C2;

ctrl_pts r,Pm1,p0,p1,p2;
computed_path.clear();
for (int i=0;i< control_points.size() - 3;i++)
{
Pm1 = control_points[i];
p0 = control_points[i+1];
p1 = control_points[i+2];
p2 = control_points[i+3];
for (int s=0;s<=step;s++)
  {
  t = double(s) / (double) step;
  t2 = t  * t;
  t3 = t2 * t;
  Cm1 = -1.0/6.0 * t3 + 0.5 * t2 - 0.5 * t + 1.0/6.0;
  C0 = .5 * t3 - t2 +2.0/3.0;
  C1 = -.5*t3+.5*t2+.5*t+1.0/6.0;
  C2 = 1.0/6.0*t3;
  r.x = Cm1*Pm1.x+C0*p0.x + C1*p1.x+C2*p2.x;
  r.y = Cm1*Pm1.y+C0*p0.y + C1*p1.y+C2*p2.y;
  r.z = 0;
  computed_path.push_back(r);
  }
}
}
Best Regards
S.Ancelot

Aaron Spike a �crit :

Hi St�phane

This looks very interesting, you also have a beautiful website-Patrick

St�phane ANCELOT wrote:
> 
>   t = double(s) / (double) step;
>   }
> }
> }

If this approximates NURB curves with Cubic Bezier Curves this will be a
very useful routine. How is it licensed?

Aaron Spike

Hi Aaron and fellow Inkscapers

Have you thought anymore about what  I can do to improve Inkscape's DXF
capabilities? Would it be a good idea to revive the
abandoned GSoC DXF project, as you were saying?

I read your last thread regarding skipping over the DXF issue and saving
work as GSD. Having GSD support sounds like it would make lots of people
happy but I think there are lots of people like myself who could use the
DXF files as well.

Would it be a good idea to split the save-as dialog up? The regular
illustrator graphic formats could be left as is and the specialty file
formats could be placed under an export menu. We could have  DXF, GSD
and why not custom DXF scalings. For example here are some hypothetical
examples:

Export as:
GSD
DXF(standard CAD)
DXF(blah blah cutter)
DXF(blah blah device)
DXF(custom)
Plus some other weird file types

BTW I have never owned a vinyl cutter but I am confident that I could
write a program to control one, given enough time. I rebuild and resell
analytical laboratory instruments like chromatographs and
spectrophotometers. Proprietary software hurts my business and drains my
customers budgets(and their fighting Hepatitis/Cancer etc). I am
obsessed with the idea of writing an open source instrument control/data
analysis App. I have spent quite a bit of time researching the
communications involved. I might be able to monitor the communication
between cutter and native software and copy the commands. Is direct
device control a direction that Inkscape should go in?

Thanks-Patrick

Patrick wrote:
> Have you thought anymore about what  I can do to improve Inkscape's DXF 
> capabilities? Would it be a good idea to revive the 
> abandoned GSoC DXF project, as you were saying?

You had asked where the GSoC project went. I really don't remember what
happened. I think it might live at
http://sourceforge.net/projects/dxf-svg-convert/. IIRC Kees Cook looked
through it and found a number of security issues. More information could
probably be found on the Mailing list archives if you search for the
author's name.

I still think reviving this would be a good idea. Didn't it even have
provisions for rendering 3d data into 2d?

> I read your last thread regarding skipping over the DXF issue and saving 
> work as GSD. Having GSD support sounds like it would make lots of people 
> happy but I think there are lots of people like myself who could use the 
> DXF files as well.

Certainly. GSD satisfies the needs of a much smaller community.

> DXF(blah blah device)
> DXF(custom)
> Plus some other weird file types

This has been discussed. We would like to create an Export menu for
lossy formats like these.

Another option would be to look at code in the Uberconvertor
(VectorSection) project and see what can be transfered over into the
Uniconvertor project.

> BTW I have never owned a vinyl cutter but I am confident that I could 
> write a program to control one, given enough time. I rebuild and resell 
> analytical laboratory instruments like chromatographs and 
> spectrophotometers. Proprietary software hurts my business and drains my 
> customers budgets(and their fighting Hepatitis/Cancer etc). I am 
> obsessed with the idea of writing an open source instrument control/data 
> analysis App. I have spent quite a bit of time researching the 
> communications involved. I might be able to monitor the communication 
> between cutter and native software and copy the commands. Is direct 
> device control a direction that Inkscape should go in?

I think this would be the ultimate. Not sure if it belongs in Inkscape
or at the OS level. Most, if not all, of the desktop cutters used by the
scrapbooking communities are bound to Win32. Supporting these devices in
linux would be a huge gain for those communities, I think. But it would
be difficult to support, because there doesn't seem to be the techinical
resources inside the communities (no offense meant :-) ).

Aaron Spike

HI Aaron and list

Okay, judging from your feedback would the following be logical?

I would search for more DXF info including the abandoned project. I
would modify the existing DXF export or create a new one. If people were
happy with the code it could be integrated into Inkscape and the GUI 
later.

I can do further tests with capturing serial communications data on my
lab instruments. Once I perfect this I will put the call out to the
vinyl cutter owners for assistance. I could then write a vinyl cutter
control app in Linux. We could then figure out how to control the App
from Inkscape, whether that would be direct integration or something 
else.

This will likely take 1-5 months.

Does this seem logical??

Thanks-Patrick

Patrick wrote:
> I would search for more DXF info including the abandoned project. I 
> would modify the existing DXF export or create a new one. If people were 
> happy with the code it could be integrated into Inkscape and the GUI later.

We'd have to talk to Ted to be sure, but I believe input and output
"extensions" are fairly easy to create and easy to add or remove from
the core.

> I can do further tests with capturing serial communications data on my 
> lab instruments. Once I perfect this I will put the call out to the 
> vinyl cutter owners for assistance. I could then write a vinyl cutter 
> control app in Linux. We could then figure out how to control the App 
> from Inkscape, whether that would be direct integration or something else.

Perhaps somebody familiar with this sort of thing on linux could give us
a better idea of how linux does these things.

> This will likely take 1-5 months.
> 
> Does this seem logical??

Sound good to me. Please subscribe to the dev list.

Aaron Spike

On Wed, 2007-10-24 at 21:17 -0500, Aaron Spike wrote:
> Patrick wrote:
> > I would search for more DXF info including the abandoned project. I 
> > would modify the existing DXF export or create a new one. If people were 
> > happy with the code it could be integrate into Inkscape and the GUI later.
> 
> We'd have to talk to Ted to be sure, but I believe input and output
> "extensions" are fairly easy to create and easy to add or remove from
> the core.

Yes, they are :)

> > I can do further tests with capturing serial communications data on my 
> > lab instruments. Once I perfect this I will put the call out to the 
> > vinyl cutter owners for assistance. I could then write a vinyl cutter 
> > control app in Linux. We could then figure out how to control the App 
> > from Inkscape, whether that would be direct integration or something else.
> 
> Perhaps somebody familiar with this sort of thing on linux could give us
> a better idea of how linux does these things.

Well, for doing serial you can generally just write to /dev/ttyS0 and
you're good.  In general, I'd recommend putting the device specific
stuff into a library.  Then you can build a client or connect it into
other things (like Inkscape) easily.

    --Ted

Aaron Spike a �crit :
>> double Cm1,C0,C1,C2;
>>   {
>>   computed_path.push_back(r);
>>   }
>> }
>> }
> 
> If this approximates NURB curves with Cubic Bezier Curves this will be a
> very useful routine. How is it licensed?
> 
> Aaron Spike
> 

The version you can find on my website is an enhanced version of the
GSoC version dxf2svg.
dxf2svg  is GPL licensed , since I did not have had any answer from the
author , I made available this slightly enhanced version through my 
website.
However, you can copy and modify the above code (I wrote it, I grant you
to do so ...).
Best Regards
S.Ancelot

St�phane ANCELOT wrote:
> The version you can find on my website is an enhanced version of the
> GSoC version dxf2svg.
> dxf2svg  is GPL licensed , since I did not have had any answer from the
> author , I made available this slightly enhanced version through my website.
> However, you can copy and modify the above code (I wrote it, I grant you
> to do so ...).

Patrick,
Sounds like you should start with this enhanced version rather than
backing up and working on the GSoC version. We should ask Kees Cook to
remind us what the security issues were, or possibly we could find that
info on the mailing list and save him the bother.

Aaron Spike

Hi Aaron

I will search the archives tonight as I have no way of contacting Kees.
I think I might be able to write/modify a program to log serial/USB port
activity on Windows computers. We could then translate the commands into
a Linux program, this would give people the option to run the cutters
from Linux.

-Patrick

Patrick wrote:
> Hi Aaron
> 
> I will search the archives tonight as I have no way of contacting Kees.
> I think I might be able to write/modify a program to log serial/USB port
> activity on Windows computers. We could then translate the commands into
> a Linux program, this would give people the option to run the cutters
> from Linux.
> 
> -Patrick

Speaking as one of those cutter users that Aaron and Bibi were 
referencing (tho' I am NOT afraid of my computer! Nor programming, etc., 
hence my being here! lol), I think the majority of the vinyl cutter 
users in our circle use Windows XP. I don't know if this matters or not, 
but thought I should mention it.
Shirley

Hello Everyone :)

I'm not super technologically savvy, I probably only know enough to get
myself in trouble ;) I found this thread by doing searches, as I'm 
having
the problem with my DXF files coverted to GSD files in using one of the
aforementioned digital craft cutters (the Silhouette, to be exact,
manufactured by Graphtec and using the Robomaster software also 
mentioned
above).

I'm interested in any fix to get these files to cut properly once they 
are
in GSD format. I've contacted QuicKutz already, the company who has
contracted Graphtec to make their product, the Silhouette Digital Craft
Cutter, and I'm guessing that any change on their end, if even effected,
would be super slow, at best. This seems to be the way things go when 
big
corporations are involved.

Wondering if the decision had been made to possibly include a "save as 
GSD"
in another version of Inkscape. I can't really tell by following the 
thread
as I'm not sure who is involved in actual Inkscape development here 
(Ted?
Aaron?) I'll check the Inkscape site again next, but I don't recall 
finding
anything on their site about it under the FAQ's yesterday.

So glad I found this thread as I understand the problem (albeit in a 
techie
unsavvy limited fashion) better now ;)

Thanks for whatever information anyone can provide!
Cindy


Shirley Pena wrote:
>> -Patrick
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc.
> Still grepping through log files to find problems?  Stop.
> Now Search log events and configuration files using AJAX and a browser.
> Download your FREE copy of Splunk now >> http://get.splunk.com/
> _______________________________________________
> Inkscape-user mailing list
> Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
> 
> 

--
View this message in context: 
http://www.nabble.com/Inkscape-and-DXF-files--tp13328343p14603455.html
Sent from the Inkscape - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Cynful wrote:
> Cutter, and I'm guessing that any change on their end, if even effected,
> would be super slow, at best. This seems to be the way things go when big
> corporations are involved.

What problems are you having with cutting the files that you create in
Inkscape and convert to GSD with Robomaster?

> Wondering if the decision had been made to possibly include a "save as GSD"
> in another version of Inkscape. I can't really tell by following the thread
> as I'm not sure who is involved in actual Inkscape development here (Ted?
> Aaron?) I'll check the Inkscape site again next, but I don't recall finding
> anything on their site about it under the FAQ's yesterday.

I think there is a general consensus that we would like to support the
GSD format. As of right now no one that I know of has begun implementing
  GSD support in Inkscape. If you were able to convince Graphtec (or any
other company privy to the details) to release a specification for the
GSD file format that would be hugely enabling for us. At this moment we
would need to reverse engineer the file format, which is very time
consuming. Even more exciting (I think this thread was headed in this
direction) would be developing open source drivers for these cutting
machines, with the goal of cutting from directly from Inkscape and maybe
even on Linux. For that, some developers would definitely need to get
their hands on the machines.

Aaron Spike

What problems are you having with cutting the files that you create in
Inkscape and convert to GSD with Robomaster?

This is the basic problem.

When I load DXF files into the Robomaster program and save them as a GSD
file (which, in Robomaster, you have to do if you want to save the file 
at
all, it's your only save option), at some point in the process, it 
appears
to me that the file data may be getting corrupted somehow.

Sometimes the file will cut cleanly once, but sometimes it won't.  And 
if I
copy and paste the image (what I like to do from a DXF file that's been
imported into a nice clean blank GSD file so that the positioning in the
Robomaster program is as I'm used to seeing it) or if I copy and paste 
the
image to get multiple copies of it to cut on one sheet of paper, or even 
if
I just move the image around it will usually (and this happens to me 
almost
certainly every single time) somehow start cutting askew, usually in 
such a
manner that the letters don't close properly or cut over other letters 
or
over themselves, the cuts are off-line, if you know what I mean. The 
lines
no longer match up to the file placement, something most noticable in 
titles
I've created from text. I have wasted a lot of specialty paper in this
manner, unfortunately. It's hard to explain in words, but I have photos 
of
the offending files if you'd like to see them if you can let me know how 
to
email you, I can give you a visual example.

Basically, if I want to save a DXF file I've loaded it automatically
converts it to a GSD file, and that seems to be the point where the 
problems
begin. The image on the screen will look exactly as it has looked, but 
the
output will cut the patterned lines off kilter. This really messes up 
titles
quite badly, and so using Inkscape to create welded word titles yields
inconsistant results.

I love creating artwork for my Silhouette, it's a big one of the many
reasons I love my machine, and I love the ability to weld and import the
files, but it saddens me that I have this problem that ends up wasting 
so
much of my paper (and usually I use specialty paper that is fairly 
pricey)
:/   It has even occurred when I have reopened a file I've cut 
successfully
before with no changes made to the file more than simply moving the 
image to
another part of the virtual "mat" placement on screen, so that it will 
cut
on another section of paper.

Today I figured a work-around, but it's not a great one. If I create the
image in Inkscape and save it as a pdf file, I can open it in Adobe
PhotoShop Elements (I don't have any high powered Adobe programs) and 
save
it as a jpg and then open Robomaster and autotrace the jpg to get a
rendition of the file. But it's not graphically completely accurate 
anymore,
the letters will not be as smooth or well proportioned as it's an 
autotrace
of a picture.

The file could also be printed out of Inkscape and scanned with a 
scanner
and thus converted to an image file and then loaded into Robomaster via
Autotrace as well, but it might be an even rougher conversion.

I've emailed the QuicKutz Customer Rep that I've been going back and 
forth
with about this problem, and asked about what you mentioned in your last
post to me, but I don't know if they are very proprietary about their 
gsd
files, or if Graphtec has control of that, or what needs to happen to 
permit
that type of thing, but I'm checking.

Bibi, I think, explained it probably best here, up earlier in the 
thread.
She mentioned Bezier curves and how they import with some "aqua" colored
lines. I'm having that same result. I found something under the Effects
menu, Modify Path, Flatten Beziers. I tried that, hoping it might help, 
but
I couldn't see a difference on the screen and it officially failed when
cutting. Also, it did import the dxf and showed the aqua lines again, so 
I'm
not sure if it really worked. In addition, in that experiment, I avoided
grouping the image in Inkscape before saving as a dxf and I also did not 
set
line setting colors in Inkscape (which I never do, I always set that in
Robomaster) since Bibi seemed to implicate both processes in part of the
problem between dxf and gsd, but none of that made a difference.

That's the issue, I think, though perhaps not explained as well as it 
could
be. Thanks for your time and researching this, I really appreciate it, 
and
I'm sure hundreds of other Silhouette or Robo Craft users would 
appreciate
any kind of fix as well :)

Cindy
--
View this message in context: 
http://www.nabble.com/Inkscape-and-DXF-files--tp13328343p14608115.html
Sent from the Inkscape - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

In late October Aaron spent quite a bit of time coaching me with regard
to the DXF format. Others were very helpful too.

I still want to help to improve Inkscapes DXF capabilities but I am
under quite a bit of financial and time strain right now with my
business (70+ hours a week + 2 year old Son and my Wife). I have taught
myself C in the meantime, however if I am not able to get it done in the
next few months I will put a bounty on it and get someone else to do it.

I was just about to write and email on this and in fact had one saved in
my drafts folder.

I am still a little unsure of the best way to do about this. There are
in fact many versions of DXF and we are also talking about GSD. I was
also talking about the direct cutter control. All of these things would
severally bloat Inkscape and pure illustrators might object. I am not
sure what to call it but perhaps this purpose is better served by
another application that would be launched from within Inkscape. We
could then add all these features by only adding one menu item.

-Patrick

Forgive my naivety, but would it not be best to implement either of
these as output extensions, similar to this one for HPGL cutter that
someone was working on here:
http://www.3x6.nl/inkscape_hpgl/Linux%20inkscape%20save%20as%20HPGL%20file%20for%20pen%20cutting%20plotter%20extension.html

rather than a a core part of Inkscape?

-Rob A>

Hi Rob

Sorry for being so dumb but just to confirm, when you say "extension" do
you mean as in let's say the gimp animation package for gimp? A new menu
installed as an option?

That would work fine but would it be wise to co-ordinate a number of
odd-ball ideas into a single coherent application that was separate from
Inkscape but that could be launched from it.

What I mean to say is, lets say our second App is called oddball-scape.
We could add a single menu item to Inkscape "export to oddball-scape".

The data could then be used by oddball-scape for whatever purpose
without ruining Inkscape for everyone else with lots of extra options
they don't want or risk complicating maintenance of it with multiple add
on packages.

Apart from further DXF support we could start another community of
people who might want to control their cutters, plotters or even mills
and lathes.

Oddball-scape could be developed in parallel.

The fellow with the HPGL plotter has done some nice work, thanks for the
link.

-Patrick

Rob Antonishen wrote:
> Forgive my naivety, but would it not be best to implement either of
> these as output extensions, similar to this one for HPGL cutter that
> someone was working on here:
> http://www.3x6.nl/inkscape_hpgl/Linux%20inkscape%20save%20as%20HPGL%20file%20for%20pen%20cutting%20plotter%20extension.html
> 
> rather than a a core part of Inkscape?

Yes. Output extensions are exactly what we are talking about.

Aaron Spike

I was trying to clear my desk and get caught up with my e-mails and
found this thread today.
I do have many GSD files that I have converted from inkscape generated
files.  If you are a new user of inkscape there are some folks who do
not convert the files correctly, and have not correctly generated the
vector paths, so the files will cut correctly.  Also we have had
problems if they have been grouped, as well as files that have not been
simplified enough, as the cutters have a tendency to freeze up due to
buffer sizes for them.  Simplifying the paths has solved the problems
for them.

If Cindy will contact me offline, I would be happy to steer her to some
Cutter user groups, where GSD files are shared, and some great tutorials
on using inkscape for the cutters, and I can check out her problematic
GSD files and see if I can cut them on my Wishblade machine, or my KNK
Machine if saved as a EPS with bounding box.  (GSD files that have been
created in inkscape, cannot be opened by the KNK software, but GSD files
that were generated by AI can be opened).


Bibi

--
Inkscapes and More by Bibi Morris
All cutter files designed exclusively in Inkscape and/or KNK

I now sell KNK and the original Craft Robo, machines in Texas!

Find my Cutting designs at
http:\\inkscapesandmore.cuttersmarket.com
www.Cuttersmarket.com

Private Inkscape, WB/CR/Silhouette and KNK classes available